On Friday I went to 5Rhythms dancing. The teacher asked us to pair up and dance in a way that we would touch our dance partner, and to ask first whether they were OK with being touched. Mine said she was not OK, as she'd been touched inappropriately in the past. We danced together and had fun without contact. Afterwards, my thought process started by her experience and request led me to wonder whether I'm part of the problem. I concluded that my male gaze probably intimidates women, which is against my ethics so I want to stop doing it. I became quite upset that I don't know how to interact appropriately with women, and couldn't dance any more.
When I got home, Ian's email about this video was in my inbox, so I just had to watch it. Very interesting, but I feel like I'm missing something, because although it makes the problem clear, I didn't understand what action I need to take. I don't want to push that part of myself back into shadow, I want to accept and love it and still do better in my interactions with others, but I don't know what that looks like. Sure, circles rather than pyramids, stop trying to dominate others (maybe stop accepting being dominated by others?). Doesn't seem like the whole answer. I'm afraid I'm lost.
We’ve been talking about this in Ian’s deep masculine course and today we had a pretty big conversation about what to do with the desire the shadow and the energies that us men possess. Have you heard about his work there?
Hi Chris, thanks for laying this out and your sincerity of wanting to show up as better man, while at the same time, not wanting to hide your own authenticity.
It sounds like your dance partner has had previous experience of trespass, and it was truthful for her to name not wanting to be touched. I feel as a man in that moment, the move is to honour that request, while also not "taking on" the shame that it's personal to you.
This can already be healing for a woman, to have her request honoured without the man either posturing (reacting and blowing up, getting angry etc) but also not collapsing (shrinking and fully disconnecting). It's a fine line to walk.
As men, we can continually reflect and on how we show up particularly with women and treat it as an iterative process of refinement, not a need for getting it perfect.
Thanks Ian. Sorry I missed something important out of my post in the name of brevity. I've edited it now. We did dance together and had fun without contact. My depression started after that ended.
I suspect that those school bullies were jealous of your joy-friendship with those guys.
By picking on you, they challenged your guy friends to choose. They divisively demonstrated power and fear. In doing so they destroyed the fragile bond with your friends.
Although you were being attacked, you weren’t the target, your guy friends were. They were emasculated, your company was striped away using your disappointment.
This feels a bit cheeky, but I think I will add an additional comment.
Yes, of course we want to blame white men. Nothing could be easier.
It’s because guilt and blame form the system we’ve all been weaned on as a way to disperse difficulty and create closure. It makes us feel powerful to point the finger.
But essentially this opts for avoidance and stasis. It internalises the issues within single individuals and fails to address the bigger picture.
Why do men group around chain of command?
Why do we fail to see ‘threat’ as the controlling influence?
As long as society, but particularly women, alienate; lack of financial success, weakness (what ever that is), and emotional expression, men are trapped. If they break rank, in-effect, they choose to be the object of ridicule from other men and risk exile and failure. Or they keep in line. It’s a no brainer.
As we offer no serious alternatives, because we refuse to truly see them, we keep this system in place.
As long as we continue to be enticed by the carrot of financial wealth or status we trap men in this system, which then keeps us all in place. Only by releasing men from the revolving door of shame and failure, by transforming our expectations, can we release the gravity lock imprisoning them/ us.
so precious and valuable <3 thank you both
On Friday I went to 5Rhythms dancing. The teacher asked us to pair up and dance in a way that we would touch our dance partner, and to ask first whether they were OK with being touched. Mine said she was not OK, as she'd been touched inappropriately in the past. We danced together and had fun without contact. Afterwards, my thought process started by her experience and request led me to wonder whether I'm part of the problem. I concluded that my male gaze probably intimidates women, which is against my ethics so I want to stop doing it. I became quite upset that I don't know how to interact appropriately with women, and couldn't dance any more.
When I got home, Ian's email about this video was in my inbox, so I just had to watch it. Very interesting, but I feel like I'm missing something, because although it makes the problem clear, I didn't understand what action I need to take. I don't want to push that part of myself back into shadow, I want to accept and love it and still do better in my interactions with others, but I don't know what that looks like. Sure, circles rather than pyramids, stop trying to dominate others (maybe stop accepting being dominated by others?). Doesn't seem like the whole answer. I'm afraid I'm lost.
We’ve been talking about this in Ian’s deep masculine course and today we had a pretty big conversation about what to do with the desire the shadow and the energies that us men possess. Have you heard about his work there?
Yes, I'm on the course but normally attend Deus' meeting on Tuesdays, will check out yesterday's recording, thanks for the heads up :)
Hi Chris, thanks for laying this out and your sincerity of wanting to show up as better man, while at the same time, not wanting to hide your own authenticity.
It sounds like your dance partner has had previous experience of trespass, and it was truthful for her to name not wanting to be touched. I feel as a man in that moment, the move is to honour that request, while also not "taking on" the shame that it's personal to you.
This can already be healing for a woman, to have her request honoured without the man either posturing (reacting and blowing up, getting angry etc) but also not collapsing (shrinking and fully disconnecting). It's a fine line to walk.
As men, we can continually reflect and on how we show up particularly with women and treat it as an iterative process of refinement, not a need for getting it perfect.
Thanks Ian. Sorry I missed something important out of my post in the name of brevity. I've edited it now. We did dance together and had fun without contact. My depression started after that ended.
I suspect that those school bullies were jealous of your joy-friendship with those guys.
By picking on you, they challenged your guy friends to choose. They divisively demonstrated power and fear. In doing so they destroyed the fragile bond with your friends.
Although you were being attacked, you weren’t the target, your guy friends were. They were emasculated, your company was striped away using your disappointment.
This was class A manipulation.
Appreciate this additional perspective!
This feels a bit cheeky, but I think I will add an additional comment.
Yes, of course we want to blame white men. Nothing could be easier.
It’s because guilt and blame form the system we’ve all been weaned on as a way to disperse difficulty and create closure. It makes us feel powerful to point the finger.
But essentially this opts for avoidance and stasis. It internalises the issues within single individuals and fails to address the bigger picture.
Why do men group around chain of command?
Why do we fail to see ‘threat’ as the controlling influence?
As long as society, but particularly women, alienate; lack of financial success, weakness (what ever that is), and emotional expression, men are trapped. If they break rank, in-effect, they choose to be the object of ridicule from other men and risk exile and failure. Or they keep in line. It’s a no brainer.
As we offer no serious alternatives, because we refuse to truly see them, we keep this system in place.
As long as we continue to be enticed by the carrot of financial wealth or status we trap men in this system, which then keeps us all in place. Only by releasing men from the revolving door of shame and failure, by transforming our expectations, can we release the gravity lock imprisoning them/ us.
https://adrianadorsett.substack.com/p/mens-everyday-trauma-hidden-in-plain?r=24onvd&utm_medium=ios&shareImageVariant=overlay
For some more about men.
girls. not young women. girls.
🙏